In my post on the David Crowder Band, Todd Fadel of Agents of Future left a comment in which he finished up by saying: “Does the concert context [of the worship music scene] put anyone else off?”
Man, what a way to end a comment. Does it seem weird to have fan clubs for worship leaders? Does it seem odd to use the same systems to promote worship music as to promote rock stars? Does it seem a little off that people go completely nuts for the newest CD by their favorite worship leader? Does it seem unusual to hold up a few select worship leaders as idols to pursue?
Short answer: yeah.
The whole rock-star attitude is so un-Christian, yet it pervades everything in “Christian” music. Why is it impossible for people to separate rock music from rock star treatment, even in the context of worship, where a rock-star mentality should be the furthest thing from our minds? What ever happened to the simple Biblical commands to love each other without showing favoritism that we find in James 2:1-13 and elsewhere? Why do we as Christians find it necessary to copy the way the world treats musicians, especially when it comes to worship leaders?
I recently sat down with a staff member at our YMCA to discuss plans for what should hopefully be the biggest Christian concert in our town this year. (By the way, I’m gonna have to put my festival plans on hold for now. Too much going on. Maybe next year.) Anyway, this staff member is a great guy, but as he and I were talking I realized that our whole attitude in the Christian music scene has just been to copy what the world is doing in the rock music scene. He seemed enamored with the idea of getting a “really big” group in to play, and as he rattled off a few quotes he had gotten for prices of even the worship groups, I felt sick to my stomach.
I understand that promotion, travel, recording, producing, etc. all cost money, but maybe it’s time we pull back and cut expenses.
One well-known worship group he had spoken with was asking over $35,000. $35,000! To play worship music! I have a family of four, and I don’t make that much money in 2 years, let alone 2 hours of playing music that is supposed to be for God. I could send 467 goats to Kenya for that much. I could provide a month’s food and clothing to 1,000 AIDS-affected orphans in Africa for that much. I could just pay off all credit card debt for 10 families in America, totally changing their lives forever, for that much.
What’s wrong with our priorities when we’ll pay $35,000 to have a worship band come and play music to bring us closer to God, but we won’t give a couple extra bucks to the waitress to show her that God cares about her hard work? Are our priorities so out of whack that we’ll let orphans die, widows waste away, and working class parents work night and day just so we can enjoy a relaxing couple of hours in the presence of God?
I’m less ticked at the bands than I am at ourselves for allowing them to be made into rock stars. I’m sure Chris Tomlin doesn’t want to be your idol. I’m sure Matt Redman doesn’t want your worship. Why are we giving it to them?
Why are we so programmed by the media that we need to pay $35,000 to have a worship group we’ve heard on the radio come and play, when there are plenty of annointed worship bands who will do it for free, just to minister? I lead a youth group at my church, and we had a predicament this past weekend at our winter retreat – none of our usual worship leaders could make it. A couple days before the trip, I randomly met a guy who said he had a worship band and would be happy to load everything up, drive over 2 hours, and come help us out Saturday night. They didn’t ask for any money and never took up an offering (the kids all chipped in to pay for gas anyway). They did better than almost any “worship concert” I’ve been to, and I’m gonna recommend the Steve Hantschel Worship Band to everyone I meet.
I hope I never spend $35,000 to get a band to come and play, especially a worship band. If I’m gonna spend that much money, I’d rather be getting a secular band, who I expect to want rock-star treatment. It makes me sick to think of paying that much so somebody will lead worship.
How can our priorities be so twisted and perverse that we treat it like we can buy God’s favor?
I’m disgusted by our lack of Christian character in the church of America. Sorry for the depressing post, but if I were God, I’d be pissed.
The Blah Blah 
31 comments
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February 21, 2008 at 9:24 am
Ben Stimpson
I’ve often felt strange about our willingness to spend thousands and thousands of dollars on entertainment (which is what worship music amounts to for most Americans) when we’re so stingy towards the poverty-stricken and dying throughout the world, the people whom Jesus spent most of his time healing.
Sure, God’s blessed us in America, but maybe we make lots of money so we can help other people. Maybe all our money spent on worship bands, high-end sound systems, audio-visual equipment, a new CD… is just money wasted on ourselves. Maybe there are more valuable things (suffering people!) to spend our money on.
This is something that has been bugging me for a while: can I justify the wasteful way I spend money on myself when people worldwide are suffering? Do I even want to try to justify this?
February 21, 2008 at 10:32 am
jakestimp
Amen.
February 21, 2008 at 11:11 am
Santiago
I think that’s a problem you are likely to find in a lot of countries too.
Some years ago a “big christian band” from America was coming to Argentina (only to play in Buenos Aires). I knew that they were a big group, so I asked some people in my city to write to that band so that they would came here. I was expecting some expensive requirements, but the response was ridiculous. I mean, among other things, why did they ask at least a 3-stars hotel? (and obviuosly the fee was exremely high).
Sadly, this also happens with bands from this country, that became “famous” (it reminds me of Galatians 1.10) and suddenly they were unreachable.
Maybe they want to be like everyone else out there. In that case, they are doing it very well.
February 21, 2008 at 11:21 am
Tyler
At some point it becomes an individual decision to treat worship leaders like idols. They feel called to tour, to write worship songs, and to make money doing that. It is not your job to judge them…if you are concerned about the money maybe you should look into what they do with that money. I do get what you are saying, but to simply blast them all without knowing their hearts is pretty judgmental in my mind and not fair. Clearly God has blessed guys like Tomlin and Redman to reach and touch people in amazing ways.
February 21, 2008 at 12:40 pm
Jessie
Preach it! Our youth group watch a Voice of the Martyrs video series on the underground church in Vietnam, and in the last episode the teenagers from America and Australia visited an underground church in rural Vietnam and the people there had no band, no electricity to speak of much, no instruments, just voices of a few hundred people shouting praises to God, most of them off key and cracking. They were clapping and so full of joy and devotion to God, that it brought tears to my eyes every time I watched it. But we feel like we need lights, high tech sound systems, promoters, etc. but it’s all for Christians, mostly. If I were a non-Christian, I’d be more drawn in by people being real and giving everything up for God, selling everything to give to the poor and worshipping God in dance and song with everything they’ve got–everyone on the “worship team” by singing, clapping, playing instruments of their own, singing in the Spirit, dancing in the Spirit, stomping, and rejoicing together, not just standing still and watching and clapping for the band on the stage.
February 21, 2008 at 1:23 pm
dorseytunes
I had the same experience a year ago when I was looking for worship musicians to come to our church or town. I contacted the band (no name dropping, but they are one of the biggies) and they directed me to the booking agency. I was questioned on how much experience I’ve had in organizing an event. I figured it wasn’t going to be cheap, but the bottom line turned out to be $25,000. I was dumb founded. We don’t get alot of Christian artists coming through our area, so I thought we would be able to work something out if they were passing by on tour. This was not the case.
My take on it is this. The choices you make as an artist (ex. booking agencies, record companies, etc.) could make your ministry untouchable to the average church. As a worship leader/songwriter, I want to always be in a place where I have full say in how much (if any) money is spent from another church to bring me in.
FYI….if I can get flight expenses covered & stay at someone’s home. I’ll use the local band and we’ll have a good ol’ time worshiping God! 🙂 And if a CD is bought along the way…praise God! My 2 cents has left the building.
February 21, 2008 at 1:24 pm
jakestimp
Tyler, I think you misunderstand my post. I’m not simply blasting all big-name worship leaders without knowing their hearts. In fact I wrote that I’m “less ticked at the bands than I am at ourselves for allowing them to be made into rock stars.” I agree that we’re all held individually accountable.
I’m not judging individual bands or worship leaders as good or evil based on what they charge for shows. Like you said, I don’t know what they use their money for, and however much they charge, I’m sure it’s within the reasonable realm.
What I am judging is the culture of idolatry and rock-star ministry we’ve created that causes us to feel it’s worthy paying $35,000 to be led in worship simply because the band is played on more radio stations or we can find more of their CDs in bookstores.
I’ve helped put on a lot of Christian concerts, and almost all the bands have been really great normal guys who tried hard to downplay the rock-star factor, but they’re still being marketed and promoted for business. Rock-stars make money; really great normal guys don’t.
Jesus and the disciples gave the gospel away for free. What are we doing charging even a penny to usher in His presence? Ministry was never meant to be big business.
February 22, 2008 at 12:15 am
Tyler
I agree with that Jake.
I think Dorsey’s comment was pretty naive. Any artist would like to be able to run everything, but with a well known name it becomes impossible to do it all. Jake is talking about our propensity to worship these worship leaders, not that they charge so much, but that they can charge so much because people pay it. If you were to make it big, you wouldn’t be deciding everything, there is just no way. It is your choice to decide if you want to do things like signing with a bigger label and such, but how much you charge and where you go on tour and all is not something you can greatly control.
February 22, 2008 at 9:09 am
jakestimp
Don’t get me wrong – I do think there are things wrong with an artist charging insane amounts to come and play a show, but what’s more wrong (in my mind) is the culture that causes us to WANT to pay them so much.
There are legitimate costs that go into producing a concert. I understand that. But why do we even feel we need all that extra stuff?
And, really, what’s wrong with doing things the old-fashioned method? If you think God has called you to do something, just do it and trust that He’ll provide. It’s weird to be charging for ministry.
I guess, if you look at it as entertainment and not ministry, then maybe it’s not so weird. Either way, I’m a cheapskate, so I just don’t get it.
February 22, 2008 at 6:39 pm
Keith
I disagree with your blog. It is very, very expensive to tour these days.. Imagine taking 15 people on the road with you full time.. paying for a tour bus rental, or 2.. a tractor trailer to haul the gear in.. diesel at 3.50 a gallon and a 300 gallon tank.. the sound equipment and light show..
then the group has to pay 20% to the booking agent.. 15% to their manager, 10% to their business manager, pay a road manager to deal with all the things the promoter forgot about..
The reason they wanted to know if you had any experience with promoting a concert is because they didnt want to drive 500 miles to do a show for you and your family. It happens all the time…
Its good for a new promoter to start with local artists like Steve,.. the issue is name recognition and credibility. Very few know of his band, and since he is not on a record label.. people do not know if his group is worth their time to drive out and see.
its a catch 22.. but lets give the CCM industry a break gang.. you really do not know what you are talking about.
Peace
January 20, 2014 at 9:50 am
John
Wow I would take 35 grand to do a show for a “family.” Who cares if it’s only for a ” family” does the 35 grand band think they are too good to just play for five. That’s right it’s not just about the money but the screaming crowd so they can feed of there energy, forget about helping lead someone to worship and sharing there testimony in song.
February 22, 2008 at 6:42 pm
Keith
also.. a workman is worthy of his hire.. the church in the USA has become steeped in Walmart mentality and entitlement mentality.. They want things for nothing.. they dont want to be inconvenienced and they think the world owes them something..
February 22, 2008 at 6:47 pm
Keith
“And, really, what’s wrong with doing things the old-fashioned method? If you think God has called you to do something, just do it and trust that He’ll provide. It’s weird to be charging for ministry.”
People arent drawn to old fashioned methods.. unless they are methodists and want to hear a pipe organ.
And it takes more than trust.. Its work and faith.. lots of both to put on a successful concert.. One without the other and you are dead in the water.
Artists dont charge for the ministry.. they charge for the business of being able to do ministry.. Imagine if your church didnt have anyone give.. it would be gone quickly. churches are the biggest business out there. They have to be operated smartly to survive.
And.. you can do a concert on a love offering basis.. but most times.. people dont value a concert that is an offering.. Charge a reasonable fee, give them a great time and they’ll pay and.. come back again..
We have to get out of this mindset that the business side of ministry is somehow evil..No its not.. it is necessary to be able to do the ministry.
You try running a business on offerings and see how far you get.
February 22, 2008 at 6:49 pm
Keith
“Jesus and the disciples gave the gospel away for free. What are we doing charging even a penny to usher in His presence? Ministry was never meant to be big business.”
Jesus and the disciples lived in a very different culture and time. to compare that to now is really crazy.
Close every church, according to you.. because ministry is big business.
February 22, 2008 at 6:51 pm
Keith
Newsflash…
we live in the world folks.. which is driven by commerce..when we get to heaven, there wont be the need for money.. but right now.. we live in hell so to speak.. and the devils system is one of commerce and capitalism. Go live in Russia or Cuba and experience real hell.
February 23, 2008 at 5:05 am
todd fadel
For what it’s worth for the sake of the conversation, I wanted to say that I’d love it if my wife and I could do workshops and songshares for a living. I’d love it if God gave me and Ang the wisdom to know “how that works”.
Let’s do more to model different treatment to those who are part of our body, rather than lament how far things have come. They go this far because creative people who could be brainstorming different models of worship aren’t doing what they could be.
I envision communities learning how to appreciate and support and raise up EVERY MEMBER who has a voice (and those w/o) and BE FANS of EACH PERSON in their community. Wear t-shirts of other community members.. I don’t know. I don’t think fandom isn’t all bad, it just needs to be spread around.
I’ll stop now.
February 23, 2008 at 11:48 pm
aaronivey.com
yikes….this is SO TRUE. thanks for posting this. the rock star worship leader thing is really annoying and frustrating. and my stomach also turns at $35,000.
February 24, 2008 at 7:45 am
jakestimp
Keith, you had a lot of points you brought up and I’d like to give you a reasonable response to each one, but I don’t think I have adequate space just in the comments section here. So instead I’ll give an unreasonable response to just one of your points.
You said, “Jesus and the disciples lived in a very different culture and time. To compare that to now is really crazy.” Well, if that’s the case, then I’d gladly be called crazy. The whole point of Christianity is to look at how Jesus and the disciples did things, and model our behavior from it.
Otherwise, why don’t you just go and pick and choose what teachings you like and what teachings you want to delete because either your cultural bias or your own experience seem to dictate otherwise?
I hope my theology is never built around my own experiences, convictions, or biases but always around the Bible, whether it seems to match what I’ve experienced or contradict it.
I could go on forever, but I think I’ve made my point.
February 27, 2008 at 1:22 pm
Oren
Last I heard (may not be true, can’t find the source) Michael W. Smith costs $40,000 just to book – and that’s if you provide all the necessary music and stage equipment, venue, etc.
Excellent article, as always.
March 3, 2008 at 5:53 pm
John
I stumbled on this blog because I was trying to book a worship band for a men’s retreat in 2009. I don’t know what all the fuss is about. I fully expect to pay $25,000 – $35,000. Because I’m buying into the lie? Because I worship the leader? No, because I want to make sure I get exactly what I’m paying for because I am very specific about the vision of the retreat.
Yes, I can buy 427 goats. But I can also buy a goat right now. You can buy a goat. Everyone reading this can buy a goat. I can buy 20 goats a month with my rent payment. So what? That kind of reasoning is silly. Does everything that is “supposed to be for God” need to have some arbitrary value? Set by whom? You? Me? It doesn’t make any sense.
If God calls you to do something, just do it. If you can’t put on an event that draws people in because it’s lame, don’t blame the Christian music industry. If you can put on an event without them, awesome!
Bibles should be free, everything Christian should be free, we should be able to copy worship music and all pastors should get a second job. Blah blah blah.
Find out what God wants you to do and do it. It may mean taking a chance on a worship leader (which was awesome by the way!) or it may mean hiring Michael W. Smith and putting all brown M&M’s in the shape of a cross in his hotel room. Each way has its own potential benefits and potential liabilities for the Kingdom.
One last thing. Your last statement “If I were God, I’d be pissed.” You realize how amazingly arrogant that sounds don’t you? It just didn’t seem to fit with the rest of your post.
Having said all that, it was a fun post. Thanks. I love the passion.
March 3, 2008 at 10:00 pm
jakestimp
Thanks for the comments, John. Just to be clear, I don’t in any way think that it’s sin to pay $25,000 for a good Christian worship leader to come in. I just think it’s stupid and a waste of money.
FYI, too: I’m a youth pastor and get paid to do ministry. I have a second job, and a third job, and a fourth job, and a fifth job, just so my family can make it, but I don’t want it to be that way forever. I hope some day that the church can fully support me and I won’t have to do all these side jobs.
But I’d never want to start charging the high school students to come to the youth group each week. Besides the fact that if I did, I’d only make between $50 and $100 a week, I doubt I’d even be getting that for long.
If it’s ministry, I don’t want to put a price on it. If it’s entertainment, then go ahead and charge. I still think it’s stupid to pay so much just for a recognizable name, but feel free to waste your money.
March 4, 2008 at 1:57 am
Scott Keller
First, are we talking $35,000 for a worship leader to come, or a worship band with a tractor-trailer rig, lights, a PA, a staff, and vehicles?
I’ve done a bit of traveling (on a much, much lower budget), and most times it has cost me to go on the road. I hardly ever come home with more money in my pocket than I leave with.
But even at that, a lot of churches have the same attitude that this blog has about paying artists/worship leaders to come to their church. They gasp when we ask them for $2000 to come play. But to fly a band in from across the country, put them in hotels for a weekend, it’s not cheap. It costs money, man. Hotel rooms, food, fuel, airline tickets aren’t free.
I appreciate the heart of your post, but be careful about making judgments about people.
March 4, 2008 at 7:41 am
jakestimp
Let me be really clear for those who misread and think I’m judging the artists:
I’M NOT JUDGING THE ARTISTS, THE CHURCHES, THE INDUSTRY, OR ANYBODY.
What I’m judging is the whole culture that has turned worship of God into a business.
Why do churches think it’s normal to spend half their year’s budget on a concert? Why do we as fans feel we need to see Michael W. Smith (or whoever) so much that we’ll pay $50 a ticket, when we could worship God just as easily if we took a walk with some headphones on, for free?
I know big concerts cost money to put on. I’m not that upset about worship leaders charging for it. I’m upset that we’ve created a culture that requires the big concert in the first place.
The idea of charging for ministry goes against so much Scripture that I don’t have the space to write it all here. Just look at how the early church operated. Look at who funded Paul’s ministry. Look at what Peter charged for his ministry materials. Look at how Jesus lived. Look at the tithe in ancient Israel – it was optional. Look at the Greek word for minister.
I can not believe that God ever intended for worship to be something you buy and sell.
March 6, 2008 at 4:29 pm
Matt
Somehow I am not surprised at this. The Christian music industry sells billions of dollars worth of music every year. The industry milks Christians for everything they can get. It’s not ministry; it’s a business.
Does the music minister to people? Sure. Do the musicians support noble causes? Sure. But the question is: how many musicians would do it if there was no fame in it, if there was no money to be had and no one asking for their autograph.
It is silly to believe that some band with guitars performing for two hours is worth more than a full year’s wages. But many times the management companies are the same for Christian groups as they are for secular bands.
All of this makes me miss Keith Green. Giving your albums away for donation is unheard of. When it comes to Christian ministries the word “donation” is a misnomer and might as well be a price tag. Sadly Keith Green’s albums these days are not for donation. Apparently his music is a cash cow that too can be milked.
I don’t think it’s wrong to make a living, but being on a stage too often makes people idolize you. It makes them think that you’re not a sinner and that your life is perfect. Sadly nothing could be farther from the truth.
March 6, 2008 at 5:09 pm
jakestimp
Well said, Matt.
March 7, 2008 at 9:22 pm
Just Doing Business « Solomon Hezekiah
[…] some time this has even extended to the area of worship music. As The Blah Blah notes, we even have star worship leaders. Of course you can’t blame someone if they are so good at […]
April 28, 2009 at 2:46 pm
Joel
A very interesting post, but after reading the comments all I can say is why are we (the body of Christ) spending so much time debating with each other? I understand the the post and agree that we should not worship the worship leader; and as one called to worship I (personally) wonder sometimes about the difference of being worshipers and just rock stars…… who just happen to be Christians. I’m not casting judgment on anyone, only God can because He looks at the heart. The gospel is free, it just takes money to get it from point A to point B. I cannot justify or condemn anyone for what they do, I don’t know the costs (I’m sure it takes A LOT to go on tour) and I don’t know their hearts. What I will say is wrong is what the word says is wrong, and that is idolatry. We as humans always are trying to be imitators of someone; unfortunately, we imitate flawed people instead of Christ. Just my thoughts- God Bless.
May 5, 2009 at 11:17 pm
Jeremy
Jake,
I spent several minutes reading through your post and wanted to address one thing.
“Why do churches think it’s normal to spend half their year’s budget on a concert? Why do we as fans feel we need to see Michael W. Smith (or whoever) so much that we’ll pay $50 a ticket, when we could worship God just as easily if we took a walk with some headphones on, for free?”
I would stretch to say we do this because we do not fully understand the heart of worship. The point of worship is about connecting to God and being transformed into the image of Christ. We pay $50 dollars to “worship” because we don’t realize we can put on headphones and go for a walk and “worship”. Or sit in silence or study scripture or simply sit in my living room and sing a new song to the Lord.
I won’t comment on the music industry, as I am in the industry, but I remember a man named Keith Green who after several years in the Christian music industry started doing concerts for free because he felt that was what God wanted from him. He connected with God and that’s how he was transformed. I believe there are many things wrong with the “Christian Music Industry”, but, I think, there are also many things right. God continues to work through and in spite or our ignorance.
Praise Him for that!
May 16, 2012 at 11:18 pm
gagetaylor
As an audio engineer, musician, and former worship leader, I am torn both ways on this matter. On the one hand, I see the costs of equipment to make a worship service flow smoothly so no one is interrupted by hisses, clicks, pops, feedback and other annoyances. I know that it takes an expensive mixing console and PA system with good microphones and lots of inputs for each channel. I know that bands need good monitors (in-ears are great) and that bands need good sound in order to not be overpowered, yet not too weak in volume either. These things cost $$$$. Especially if one is touring a lot, going here and there as an act of ministry.
On the other hand, I know that Paul wrote of himself that in his preaching ministry, he did not take money from the church (though he had a right to) to support himself. Instead, so he wouldn’t be a burden and he would lead by example, he was a tentmaker on the side to provide for himself. To me, this is the way any minister should behave. It’s not bad to have good things, nor is it bad to have a lot of money, nor even to have expensive things.. however, when my tithes and offerings from hard labor go into the hands of a man whose job is to actually -do- what I myself would love to do but God hasn’t called me to it quite yet, to preach or to lead a congregation in worship, when my tithes are their income and they spend it on things I would like to go elsewhere in all reality, that’s what bugs me.
Another thing is when worship bands take profit from CDs. I think they should have a small minimal price, or perhaps a donation request and leave it up to God to provide, rather than asking $10+ a pop. To me, worship music, specifically when it’s produced BY the church itself, should be free, as it belongs solely to God in the first place.
Now, Christian music tied to record labels is another story. Any band tied to a label is in debt to the label the first year or 2 until so many records are sold, then the royalties pay back the debt, and several years later -if- and only -if- the record sold well will the artist(s) get money paid to themselves. It’s the way the business works. They could go without a label, but then would have no clout to play shows they would otherwise be able to within the label’s clout.
That said, I think it’s something that should be prayerfully considered in all aspects. If a band is wanting to do worship as a touring ministry, be sure to be smart and be financially well before going on. Don’t take advantage of your position or offerings. If it’s a local worship ministry, it’s best to get what you need and keep it low-key. Remember: in worship, it’s not about you, it’s about Him.
There is no such thing as Christian or non-christian music, only music and worship. If you’re christians in a band, then you’re christians in a band. If you’re christians in a worship band, then that’s what’s going down – worship. It helps to set a mood or tone with lights and things, but you really don’t need them to worship. If you’re blessed with it somehow, great. If not, it’s not a priority; the priority is to be mature in the Spirit and have your heart in the right place.. in the blood of Christ.
August 30, 2012 at 9:27 am
Steve
Do you realize the cost to play quality music. Unless Daddy is still footing the bill for the musicians to play then the music will not be what it should. Where does the money come from to pay for all the equipment, travel, living expenses. Read about David and how he was treated as a worship musician. I think that we treat worship musicians pretty badly.
September 6, 2012 at 4:44 pm
Justin
I don’t understand the issue. If a worship leader/band shouldn’t be paid then a pastor, youth leader, evangelist, etc. shouldn’t be paid. Paul himself says that those whose livelihoods depend on delivering the gospel have a right to be paid because of it.
Yes, people shouldn’t “worship” Christian artists/bands, but the artists/bands have no control over that, and those with the right heart have no desire for it.
Of course, if an artist is making $20,000 PROFIT per show, that’s a problem (unless he or she is using those funds to do some good). The same can be said for a pastor whose salary is $80,000+.